I use my desktop PC for Jellyfin and torrenting, but I’m looking for something that I can keep on 24/7 that draws less power and run other self-hosted services on Linux. I would like to have at least 2x 14 TB 3.5" hard drives in or attached to it with the possibility of expanding in the future.
From my research, these seem to be some good options:
- Mini PC like this Beelink S12 Pro + USB hard drive enclosure. The price seems reasonable for the specs and low power consumption. Not sure if USB will limit transfer speeds.
- ODROID HC-4 or similar SBCs. I feel like these have much lower performance for not much price savings, and it’s harder to get software running up because of ARM. But it seems like they don’t use too much power.
- Used enterprise PCs/servers. I know they can be found cheap used, but I’m a little lost at comparing the performance and power draw to other options.
- DIY build. I’m interested in getting a Mini-ITX case like this Jonsbo N2 and getting parts for it, but it seems like it will be the most expensive option. It does seem like the most modular and upgradable.
- Classic NAS products like Synology. It seems like these are falling out of favor because they are pretty under powered for the price.
What does selfhosted think about these options, and what would you recommend?
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I’ve been getting pretty excited about RISC-V devices. They are quite efficient and outstrip similiar SOCs in many ways.
The Lichee Pi4A has better benchmarks than a Raspberry Pi 4 at a TDP of 4W and includes a NPU. They are coming out with a cluster board as well.
Cristopher Barnatt does a review of it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1apoFXZ9ad8
Since Debian has added RISC-V as a supported architecture, we should start seeing most major software like Docker and KVM being packaged for it. If not, it can be compiled too.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=1apoFXZ9ad8
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source, check me out at GitHub.
As an owner of the HC-2, I’d say if you don’t need to transcode and you really only need qBitTorrent and Jellyfin, the HC-4 should be an awesome NAS and media host. You really only need more power when you have scope creep, and you realize you want your home server to do more and more. In any case it’s a pretty low cost of entry, should you choose to upgrade in the future.
I have a DIY NAS… Not sure of specs any more. Some micro-atx board with a cheaper AMD CPU. All it’s for is an NFS share and I use almost no resources on it.
I have a bunch of PI4 8GB and lenovo m92p tinys that I use for the compute. Their storage is the DIY NAS.
If I was starting out and planned on growing m’y setup, id go option 4. Just do an all in one thing, run everything on it. When you run out of ram/CPU consider a pi or mini like I have. When you need more disk, add it into the NAS.
If you just want something simple option 1. USB will 100% limit transfer speed but what kind of speed do you actually need? What will you run?
Is your NAS in an old tower PC?
I think I had the misconception that USB was slower than SATA, but USB-C is actually just as fast. And anything USB 3.0+ should be faster than 1 gigabit ethernet I guess?
Theoretically, USBC 3.1 has 10Gbit/s from what I’m reading so it sounds like you’re right. My concern is the chipset on the MoBo, how many lanes it has, and what it supports. I haven’t looked into it but I bet this is the limiting factor. Especially if you’re adding a lot of USB devices.
Yep, just an old PC that I moved into a case with hotswap hard drive bays. I also bought a LSI 9300-8i to support the hard drives.
It’s not one of the options you listed, but it’s worth considering a laptop since it has a UPS built in.
- Laptop with broken screen
Perfectly server grade, the way the manufacturer intended
Amen. Also they tend to draw less power than your average cheap desktop, so it’s a great middle ground between pc and sbc
And usualy they ARE SBCs. So…
Do you have a NAS? It can be a good way to get decent functionality without extra hardware, especially if you’re doing proof of concept or temporary stuff.
My self-hosting Docker setup is split between 12 permanent stacks on a Synology DS920+ NAS (with upgraded RAM) and 4 on a Raspberry Pi 4B, using Portainer and its agent on the Pi to manage them. The NAS is also using Synology’s Drive (like Dropbox or GDrive) and Photos (like Google Photos).
I’ve had the NAS running servers for Valheim and VRising in the past, but they require that fewer containers be running, as game servers running on Linux usually have no optimisation and/or are emulating Windows.
If I decide to host a game server again, I’ll probably look at a NUC. I’ve done the DIY mini-ITX route in the past (for an XBMC-based media centre with HDMI output) and it was great, so that’s another option.
I’ve tried a few of the things you mention over the years.
However, I’ve lately gotten into the used business PCs. The performance of even a 6th get Intel CPU more than double an RPI4 or the ATOM in my NAS, depending on how you count. Sure, it’s quite a bit more power, and they have their place (RPI in the garage), but I’ve gotten a few SFFs that have room for multiple HDs for like $50-$60 shipped, as long as i’m patient, since I don’t care for the windows license.
The CPU benchmark sites are what convinced me that more SBCs was not the solution for me.
I also tell myself that i’m recycling what could have been ewaste otherwise. I am afraid to calculate the energy cost.
I also try and ignore energy costs and prevent ewaste: my home server is my three builds back gaming PC with a lower power GPU shoved into it. Whenever I build a new main gaming PC my old one becomes my wife’s gaming PC, and her old PC is rebuilt into the home server.
Can you talk a bit more about the CPU benchmarking? What sites do you usually refer to? Is score the best metric or do you look for something else as well?
There are lots of them out there.
For example passmark is one of many.
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu_list.php
I just go find my CPU and use the number to compare to eBay listings. Is it perfect? No.
But it gives you an idea. Each site has some set of algorithms and they get a score for how quickly it can execute on that hardware.
Some of them they allow users to run their system and submit numbers so you get a better sense.
For the money: Used sff like an optiplex 7050 or similar for $100. Typically <20W, real computer performance, can handle a bunch of ram, pcie accelerators depending on what you get into. Add a multi drive enclosure for more storage when needed.
This is what I did and I love it. I will add that sff is bad for upgrades. I wanted to add a gpu to mine and now I have to buy a larger case to put it in.
I just decided to bite the bullet on paying for a Synology DS920+ and I don’t regret it at all. For media hosting on my scale, 4K direct or 1080p transcodes to 6 or less concurrent streams, it does everything I need it to do and it has pretty decent software.
Only problem that I have with mine is it just doesn’t have the power to transcode audio flawlessly. I have a lot of DTS content and it just stutters all the time. I had to set up a Tdarr pipeline just to add EAC3 tracks to everything.
I have not experienced this with any lossless transcodes and my friends streaming remote haven’t said anything about it. What client are you using to watch media?
It was streaming locally from my 920+ directly to my LG tv using the official Plex app on the tv and the Plex docker container on the NAS with iGPU passthrough. Tried it in both mp4 and mkv formats. Since the tv doesn’t support DTS it was transcoding into (I think) AAC. When I would change the playback from DTS to any other codec (for files with multiple formats), the video would play flawlessly, it was just the audio transcoding.
I think every time I’ve heard about the plex smart TV app it has not been positive lol
Gonna be honest, I don’t know the exact logistics behind plex transcoding and what resources it may or may not use on the client and I’ve never tried a smart TV app as a client. I’m really not in a place to comment on it. But I can attest to having no issues when transcoding lossless formats to windows or the Nvidia shield.
I feel like a loser after reading some of these awesome setups, but i just use an rpi4 4gb. It’s enough for 1-2 ppl casual use as NAS, media server, nextcloud, pihole, and a few other things here and there. I have USB hub with it’s own power supply because if not the hard drives lose power occasionally. All in all it’s like 20W max but usually under 10. Best of all it’s completely silent.
I think your setup is fine. I use a raspberry pi on each TV in my home as a media player (Jellyfin, retroarch, sometimes steam link) then also make them act as a docker cluster on the backend to play around with making some services ‘high availability’ so that the service moves around to whichever TV is not under load. I’m also playing with HDMI-CEC on those Pi’s to let my home assistant (also running on a single board computer, zima board) send commands to the TVs and all HDMI connected devices. I have a Pi running Open Media Vault with two drives that provide redundancy. The only high power device I use is my Linux gaming machine also doubles as my Jellyfin transcoder.
I too enjoy the silence and lack of moving components of this setup.
Same. I’m using a 2012 Mac mini running Proxmox attached to an OWC Thunderbay 4. It’s old but does everything I need it to do.
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I had a 10Gbps USB Icy Box enclosure, speeds were ok but cooling was simply inadequate. Now I have just built a pc with an Asus B550-Plus and a 5600G, idles at 19W with the drives in standby but with three fans active. I thought about going with a mini pc and a better external enclosure, but that would’ve been much more expensive and I doubt that I would’ve saved that much power with that anyway
I set myself a budget of ~€150 and eventually settled on a Lenovo Mini PC with an i5 and 8 GB of ram for €160 including shipping. In retrospective, one of those Beelink mini PC’s would have been a better option, they use significantly less energy and have a better performance/price ratio.
I recommend going with option 1.
Just make sure you get an Intel box. If OP ever wants to use Plex it only plays nicely with Intel and Nvidia hardware transcoding.
As I always say, have a look through https://forums.serverbuilds.net They have tons of guides on building whatever you need at whatever price point you can afford. The NAS Killer 5.0 is pretty great and I went with a second box for transcoding. Both low power and pretty cheap.
There’s an old adage for cars that I think applies to home servers.
Fast, Cheap, Reliable. Pick two
In my experience, SBCs take a whole lot more tinkering than I like to do. I bought a cheap matx motherboard and a second hand ryzen 2400g which has served me well. Inside a second hand htpc chassis with an ssd for the os and a couple hdds for storage. It even has a 5.25" bay I can install a drive for ripping. I’d rubbing OpenMediaVault with Docker for Sonarr/Radarr/Overseerr/Nextcloud etc.
It’s probably not the cheapest to run, but it was cheap to buy and it’s very reliable because it’s based on x86 so the support will probably outlast me.
As someone with a used 4U server… the noise, weight, cost, poeer consumption all are an inconvenience generally. I now have some mini PCs and I wish I started small and built up, rather than trying to treat myself with the best single solution possible.
